im so confused..

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star e nite
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im so confused..

Post by star e nite »

Was the problem that people were using these "backdoor" links when there was technically no print up or that the "backdoor" links were used period? I know a good handful of people have been using these links for every sale but I figured that they were just computer savy tricks that I didnt know. I didnt think it was "illicit" though. Are these links technically "hacking" if they are used in a legitimate sale?
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Post by McKenna »

The links were used before the print was put live. They never put the prints up so obviously, any orders that went through were completed using the backdoor method.

Had the prints actually gone live, there wouldn't be any way of telling which orders went through using the 'backdoor' and the ones that were completed using the regular Add to Cart etc.
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Post by noverflow »

More the first one. That is what made it clear to obey that there was an issue, and the current cart system was not fair.

The links where just simple GET manipulations. They are actually designed so the user can link to them.

Look at the current address:

http://forum.thegiant.org/viewtopic.php?t=8909

once you see .php that is the end of the page. ? and on is just telling that page information, like t is = to 8909. Or, go to topic 8909. Nothing wrong with changing that number, it will just take you to an other topic.

The links told the site to add to the basket a certain print. These links however bypasses an inventory check, and also bypassed the fact that the print was not for sale yet.

Personally, I think this is an intended design on zen carts side. But it is actually a design flaw, because it allows this sort of thing to happen.

People can not say they didn't know it might not be legit though, people where commenting left and right about how they will probably just get refunded.
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Post by whyhoo »

McKenna wrote:The links were used before the print was put live. They never put the prints up so obviously, any orders that went through were completed using the backdoor method.

Had the prints actually gone live, there wouldn't be any way of telling which orders went through using the 'backdoor' and the ones that were completed using the regular Add to Cart etc.


this isn't new - people have obviously been doing this for a while now and i honestly don't think that those people are to blame for the recent INSANE slowdown of the site! in the past, the prints would sell out in 30 minutes or less - and i'm sure there were almost as many people trying. the philharmonic print took 4 or 5 hours to sell out - and that one WAS listed on the site. think about all the drama with ticketmaster and the way that the scalpers game that system - theirs is certainly a LOT more complicated than obeygiant.com's and the scalpers OWN ticketmaster.

personally, i think that the money making potential has caught the eyes of less than scrupulous people. obey wasn't able to get through to their own servers to put the products live. they must have decided to actually stop attempting at some point, because you certainly COULD get through to the site with enough persistence.
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Post by whyhoo »

McKenna wrote:The links were used before the print was put live. They never put the prints up so obviously, any orders that went through were completed using the backdoor method.

Had the prints actually gone live, there wouldn't be any way of telling which orders went through using the 'backdoor' and the ones that were completed using the regular Add to Cart etc.


**double post
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Post by lb1469 »

noverflow wrote:More the first one. That is what made it clear to obey that there was an issue, and the current cart system was not fair.

The links where just simple GET manipulations. They are actually designed so the user can link to them.

Look at the current address:

http://forum.thegiant.org/viewtopic.php?t=8909

once you see .php that is the end of the page. ? and on is just telling that page information, like t is = to 8909. Or, go to topic 8909. Nothing wrong with changing that number, it will just take you to an other topic.

The links told the site to add to the basket a certain print. These links however bypasses an inventory check, and also bypassed the fact that the print was not for sale yet.

Personally, I think this is an intended design on zen carts side. But it is actually a design flaw, because it allows this sort of thing to happen.

People can not say they didn't know it might not be legit though, people where commenting left and right about how they will probably just get refunded.


Thanks for the explination noverflow. However, there is talk of the dreaded refund on many if not all of the anticipation strings. I don't think many of the people thought they would get refunded because they thought they did something wrong as much as they were concerened about the refunds due to the technical issues that were going on, over selling or using this alternative method for the first time (for many).
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Post by fishmansvacuum »

so is EVERYONE getting refunded? I am a bit confused on that point....
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Post by erne »

Got my refund and ban from purchasing the print...hahhahhahha...

I mean seriously I spent about 11 hours on my computer at work and at home fought with my wife about it and finally got these links to work at about 2AM Eastern. Obey has to be kidding with the "true fan" BS because I am positive most of the people who tried and wasted this many hours of their life to send him money for a print are "true fans"...I don't mind the refund I figured that would come but banned from buying these prints you really have to be kidding me...thanks! maybe I can regain some dignity and not sit and waste another 8 hours of my life today looking at the Obey site crashing and trying to figure out how to get the prints. This is seriously f*&cked up and really a major slap in the face from good ol Obey to his "true fans". I have been shut out so many times over the past 2 years or so and wasted so many hours that I am really disturbed. This is the first I knew of this method...this response from Obey is disrespectful and bad PR.
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Post by polarbear »

After the garbage that Shep's pulling, I don't want it. I'd rather give my money to an artist who appreciates my loyalty and passion. What a sell-out. Just bought a Dan McCarthy -- an artist who actually uses pencil and ink and pulls his own silk screens rather than someone who uses computers, clip-art and stencils --- with the money that would have gone to this.
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Post by Ceriously76 »

Has anyone that "illicitly" ordered Peace Bummer on Wednesday Morning recieved word of a refund yet.

I have not and starting to wonder???
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Post by Dizzyegg05 »

I had refund yes. $67
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Post by BrokeFromArt »

Ceriously76 wrote:Has anyone that "illicitly" ordered Peace Bummer on Wednesday Morning recieved word of a refund yet.

I have not and starting to wonder???


I ripped my Peace Bomber out of the hands of a "true fan" on Wed. morning. I had to knock him over and snatched it from him. I gave him a kick when he was down for good measure.

Still no refund here. No police have shown up either.

So what about the people that have been buying prints like this for sometime?
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Post by rastapunk »

erne wrote:...this response from Obey is disrespectful and bad PR.


I'll be getting refunded too, but you have to understand that they had to make a decision that was going to anger people either way.

They're good people just trying to do what they think is best for the majority of their customers. By doing the ban on this print for this print they're setting a precedent of how things will work in the future.
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Post by DunDun »

I had a feeling that I would get refunded, as I suspected what I was doing wasn't totally right, but after 12 hrs with NOTHING to show for it I became desperate. It's just really really whack to alienate your "true" fans who wasted whole day only to be "banned" from this purchase. It's not like I tried to buy every print and/or shut down the site with attacks so only I could get a print.

The thing that really pisses me off about this whole issue is that if OG thinks that people who have been "banned" aren't going to find a way to buy the print they are completely mistaken. I mean if people are willing to sit around for half a day to try and buy the thing "illicitly", then they WILL and probably already have found a way to buy todays prints.

Then this brings up the issue the if flippers are gonna be the ones who get this print. If most of the people on here are banned from buying this print, then who's gonna be left to buy this print? I would guess the shoe flippers, general flippers, and the occasional "true" fan :roll:

OG really needs to get with the program and not taking everything so danm personally. Really effing lame they can't figure out how to sell a print after all these years. I can understand this incompetence from an artist/gallery that's just experiencing newfound success, like Daniel Danger, but for an artist who's involved in many levels of commerce(commercial graphic design, clothes, Dj'ing) this is just plain pathetic and a huge slap in the face of his "true" fans. Wake up Shepard, this was bound to happen to your draconian web site, don't take it out on your fans cuz you didn't want to spend the money on a real system. Spend the money on the site in the first place instead of the attitude "we only sell prints once a week through the site why should we upgrade?" LAME.
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Post by mr Revs »

I had a print bought on Jan 15th and was not refunded yet, while people who bought the print after me have been. Anybody else from Jan.15th not get a refund yet.

You know what is going to be real lame? When I have to contact obey after the print doesn't arrive for two weeks because some print refund monkey forgot to refund my money.
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Post by Dizzyegg05 »

rastapunk wrote:
erne wrote:...this response from Obey is disrespectful and bad PR.


I'll be getting refunded too, but you have to understand that they had to make a decision that was going to anger people either way.

They're good people just trying to do what they think is best for the majority of their customers. By doing the ban on this print for this print they're setting a precedent of how things will work in the future.



Good comment :wink:
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Post by the_partisans »

.
Last edited by the_partisans on Sat Dec 27, 2008 4:39 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Post by lb1469 »

rastapunk wrote:
erne wrote:...this response from Obey is disrespectful and bad PR.


I'll be getting refunded too, but you have to understand that they had to make a decision that was going to anger people either way.

They're good people just trying to do what they think is best for the majority of their customers. By doing the ban on this print for this print they're setting a precedent of how things will work in the future.


Ok, but there is no excuse for the "true fans" bit.
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Post by lb1469 »

the_partisans wrote:If there are people using scripted software to pound obeygiant.com with a system to try and buy prints.

Can't obey track the IPs that are sending this enormous amount of hits and ban them? I would assume that people are actually doing this and I would bet that the amount of hits coming from them is much more than from normal people. But I'm not an IT expert.

As for Tuesday I wasn't exactly sure whether the print had been released or hadn't and with how horrible and ill equipped their server is it was easy to assume that there was server database issues causing the site to implode and that's why the print wasn't coming up in new products because the print was obviously entered into the system. And when other people were buying up the prints, no communicatioin from Obey, and people saying you can buy the print at this link, well f**king hell yeah I'm going to try and buy the print. Who wouldn't?

It's easy for Obey to make us look like the bad guys, but one thing Obey never did address is why wasn't the print released on Tuesday like it should have been?

Why don't you tell us guys?


Well said.
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Post by admonkey »

Dizzyegg05 wrote:
rastapunk wrote:
erne wrote:...this response from Obey is disrespectful and bad PR.


I'll be getting refunded too, but you have to understand that they had to make a decision that was going to anger people either way.

They're good people just trying to do what they think is best for the majority of their customers. By doing the ban on this print for this print they're setting a precedent of how things will work in the future.



Good comment :wink:
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Post by cmyk »

Refund no problem with that.
Banned from purchase, not the coolest, but I can live with that.
Standing on a soap box and calling one side true fans, BS!

Anyone who tried for 10+ hours to get a print is a true fan, whether you got a print or not.

I would have to say 90% of people who complained to OBEY tried the direct link method and it just did not work for them. How else would they know what to complain about. And I think not getting a print and having tried for hours would be the fuel to lead to calling or emailing OBEY.
Granted some people logged on the next day, read 80 pages of forum posts, saw what unfolded and how the community of OBEY print lovers banded together to try and buy a print, and then complained. I invite anyone who tried the direct link method and did not have success, to email OBEY and ask to be banned for this print run, or at least do not participate. I think that is fair. As of now only those who were successful are being punished.

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Post by submit »

nice first post, asshat.
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Post by Gigantico »

Although Jason has nothing to do with ANY of this, and doesn't deserve ANY of the blame, that avatar is priceless!!

I always wondered what he looked like with both eyes open...
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Post by marcobelt »

mr Revs wrote:I had a print bought on Jan 15th and was not refunded yet, while people who bought the print after me have been. Anybody else from Jan.15th not get a refund yet.

You know what is going to be real lame? When I have to contact obey after the print doesn't arrive for two weeks because some print refund monkey forgot to refund my money.


HAHAHAHAHA, im not sure they know who their real fans are sadly.
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Post by cmyk »

submit wrote:nice first post, asshat.


What an intelligent response. You even managed to use a colorful metaphor for comic accent.
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